Rules of Engagement - a poll for readers and writers

[leethet]

I've been reading, and trying to write, in a new-to-me fandom. This, and my archiving of my MFU stuff on AO3, has made me think about something.

One of the things I like about LJ is that it makes actual comments about as easy as it's possible to make them barring being face to face with an author after you've finished a story (well, easier than that - what if you hated it?). One of the things I've observed in my own reading behavior in this "new" fandom is my own commenting. Now, I don't finish about 90 percent of the stories I start to read (this is true of any fandom). Of the ones I finish, I find most to be just OK (keep in mind this includes my own [see earlier poll] so I hope I don't sound too awful). Because of this, that "kudos" button is the easiest thing in the world. It sends an accurately mild (in terms of my time investment) "this was OK" message to the author.

I like it and I don't like it.

I like it because it's the exact right level of involvement for a story I only sorta liked. If I really like something I leave a comment, because if I really like something, there's always something I have to say about it.

It echoes the "like" button on FB. This is why I don't like it (yes, I'm a hypocrite. Or just human). One of the things I don't like about FB is the pretense it allows of intimacy. Of engagement. It's an extension of those Christmas form letters - "Dear INSERT NAME HERE" followed by some boasting. It (FB) allows people to pretend to maintain relationships without any of the actual (to my old-fashioned mind) maintenance of those relationships.

In this way the "kudos" button is the same; it permits readers to feel like they've "done their part" (I don't, for the record, think readers are required to do squat for writers - just so that's clear) without having actually troubled to give real feedback. Then again, do people use it because they can't think of what to say, because they're lazy, because they're busy, because they're intimidated - or because, like me, they don't really like most stories enough to feel they merit more than a lazy, in-passing thumbs up (again, I'm not finding fault with any of these approaches, just wondering)?

So, a poll. And, as always, please elaborate in comments. The way writers and readers think about stories is endlessly fascinating to me.
[Poll #1974799]

Comments

[glennagirl.livejournal.com]

The last choice in this poll is akin to kudos don't you think. And therein lies the dilemma.
I think kudos is the least that one can do to acknowledge having read a story, but I do believe with most readers it is intended as a compliment. A comment requires having some feeling about a story, unless the reader just feels obligated to say something, sort of like looking at an ugly baby and exclaiming, "Well, that's a baby!". Not really what we're after.
I like comments like all writers, and the analogy I've used many times over is that, as a performer, I expect some response from the audience in order to be truly fulfilled in that role. Yes, please applaud and let me know you didn't nod off while I played my heart out for you.
Same with a story. I put something into it and want to hear back that it had an impact of some sort. Enjoyment, conflict, euphoria (well, best case scenario there). Admittedly when a writer tells the world that she/he only comments on what they consider worthy, it does ring of a certain smugness, as though that person's taste level is so much higher than what is normally presented. Perhaps it is, although from my own perspective, it actually does sadden me just a bit to know that the people who have made that statement have never commented on one of my stories unless in a format such as Down the Chimney or some other large scale challenge.
Is this too much? I think I speak for a lot of newer writers who have come along at a time when some of you who have lived in this fandom world for much longer, have tired of the requirements to fawn over stories and shore up egos.
So I choose to not take it personally. I can play piano for myself and have the pleasure of it be immensely satisfying, but I still want some acknowledgement from the audience if they show up for the entertainment.
Having said all of that... (would you give me a kudos or simply hit the return button?), I don't always comment either. Sometimes I don't know what to say or how to phrase something that should sound complimentary but somehow can't. I think real criticism belongs in a private message with at least some form of a solution to whatever problem has been identified; at least this is true unless on a forum that invites critical analysis.
I'm sure additional conversation on this topic will unveil even more opinions, attitudes and revelations. I think it definitely adds to our experience here.

[elmey.livejournal.com]

This is an interesting subject. As much as I love getting comments and kudos as a writer, I just don't think there's any way to make readers leave them, and as a reader I'm pretty much impervious to such requests.

I have to like something about a story to leave a kudos. That can range from an author trying something different to a nice turn of phrase, to characterization I appreciate even if the story itself could be better. If I really like the story I'll comment. If someone is putting up old stories, I might just kudos instead of commenting when I run across them, there are other variations, my behaviour isn't totally consistent.

But you know, I don't read everything; I tend to skip drabbles and very short fic; I skip stories whose subject matter doesn't interest me. If the characterizations don't suit me (which happens fairly often) if I'm in a bad mood--I'll stop reading quickly. Maybe on a different day I would have tried harder. Lots of stories go by the wayside that way. I'm quite sure my stories get the same treatment from readers too, that's just how it is.

Because I do the mfu_shortstorie listings I see a lot of commenting behaviour in action, and it's actually helped me become pretty mellow about the reaction to the stories I write. There are stories that I think are tremendous that don't get much reaction. Stories that I think are trite and/or badly written that have kudos out the wazoo. So much fanfic is id driven--readers have needs they want the stories to fill, and our needs aren't always the same.

In some of the younger fandoms it seems to be de rigeur to leave kudos easily. I don't think that's true in our fandom. When the kudos system started it was so rarely used I suspected people thought their computers would explode if they hit that weird button :D But I think it's changing as people get used to the idea.

I should add the one time I do try very hard to comment (or kudos at least) is if I'm participating in a challenge. It's a small fandom and I consider it a salute to my fellow writers to acknowledge that we're in it together.

[gilda-elise.livejournal.com]

I have mixed reactions to kudos. I leave them if I like a story, and I do have to like a story quite a lot to leave kudos. But if I really like it, I try to leave a comment, though that doesn't always happen because a lot of the time I download the story to read later.

Then there are writers, like you, who I've already read—and already have a pdf of all your work. As much as I'd like to go back and respond, time forbids.

On the flipside, while I appreciate kudos, I don't take them as seriously as I do comments. And it's sort of odd, the difference in reactions when I post a story to AO3 as opposed to the fandom's own archive. The same story will get several comments on the K/S archive, yet not many kudos on AO3. Or the reverse might happen. It's makes me wonder if those reading on AO3 might not always be "into" the fandom so much as just "into" the pairing, if that makes sense.

[mayamaia.livejournal.com]

There is an extra element to kudos: it gives you a vague sense of how many people are reading the story. I have a story (under Lawrence of Arabia) which has gotten well over 5000 hits but only 5 kudos. This suggests that 5000 people have come to the story by accident for some reason, and I was puzzled over why... Turned out that one of its tags, new, showed up second on the Google search results for a story by E M Forster; another could be interpreted as relating to the Sandman series by Gaiman. The first one was ok, the second one I altered. Still getting a lot of hits on it, so it was probably the first one and the story isn't being read all the way through.

I definitely prefer getting comments, but they can be misleading indicators for readers who want to choose a fic by popularity. Same story has seven comments, but all by myself and kleenexwoman because we were tweaking it here and there.